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large
08-19-2007, 03:12 PM
I suppose this ought to go into the Sports genre, but there are those who might have opinions about this who normally wouldn't crack the Sports thread . .

OK, Vick is potentially copping a plea to get back into football whenever his Dogfighting Troubles are over ('course that may be when he's 65, who knows) and Tim Donaghy, the gambling basketball ref is gonna rat off other refs (and I'd bet there's more than one) for a lighter sentence . .

Why should they get one?

Pete Rose gambled, not to shave points or on his team to lose, but got BANNED from baseball for LIFE. "Charlie Hustle", with 4652 hits, something even Cal Ripken couldn't come close to, got BANNED from all that is and was for Pete Rose . .

Are the guys who gamble, cheat and fix events in Contemporary Professional Sports any better than Pete Rose?

If so . . WHY?

Old Sweater
08-29-2007, 11:18 PM
Pete Rose gambled, not to shave points or on his team to lose, but got BANNED from baseball for LIFE. "Charlie Hustle", with 4652 hits, something even Cal Ripken couldn't come close to, got BANNED from all that is and was for Pete Rose . .


First of all I'll admit that I cannot stand Rose and the hate started long before the gambling accusations. Started in 1976 when the Big Red Machine trounced my Yankees in 4 straight then hated him even more in the 1980 WS when he would bounce the ball off the astroturf on the 3rd out when he was playing 1st for the WS champ Phillies when they beat the Royals.

2nd/ Rose never would have broke Ty Cobbs hit record of 4,191 hits if he wasn't his own manager at the end of his career. Rose hurt his teams chance of winning by putting himself in a the lineup just to break a record.

It took Rose 2,619 more at bats to get 65 more hits. That is roughly 6 more seasons.


Pete Rose gambled, not to shave points or on his team to lose, but got BANNED from baseball for LIFE.

No one shaves points in baseball. There isn't any. Even if Rose is telling the truth, which I doubt, about just betting on his team to win, will cost your team victories in the long 162 game season. Since he said he just bet baseball as a manager, which I doubt, you can burn up the bullpen, keep your ace pitcher in the game to long past his pitch count and play your players that have a nagging injury and should be given a day or two rest. There is many things a manager can do wrong on betting on his team to win. Most people that don't watch the game just can't understand it.

Then Rose denies betting on baseball and signs this.




One question that puzzles many people is – if Rose did not bet on baseball why did he sign the settlement agreeing to being placed on the permanently ineligible list? Pete’s explanation is that he accepted the agreement because he knew that some punishment would be sanctioned upon him (he did admit to illegal gambling on NBA and NFL games and horseracing and the deputy commissioner, Fay Vincent, argued that this alone was basis for a permanent suspension). Continuing to fight in court might have lasted longer than a year so by signing the agreement he could apply for reinstatement in exactly one year


http://www.athomeplate.com/pete2.shtml



Then Rose admits to gambling to help sell his book and for a feeble attempt at reinstatement. He also done it right at the time that Robin Yount and Paul Molitor were being inducted into the Hall of Fame. Real prick that Rose is IMO for doing that to 2 great players in their week of fame.


After 14 years of denials, Rose changed his answer to the question that has defined his post-playing career: Did he bet on baseball? "I did," he told ABC News. "That was my mistake for not coming clean a lot earlier."

The confession became public three days before the release of his autobiography, My Prison Without Bars, in which Rose details his gambling addiction. ABC's Good Morning America aired portions of a Rose interview, recorded two weeks ago, to be shown in its entirety on Primetime Thursday. And Sports Illustrated released book excerpts.


http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2004-01-05-rose_x.htm

Then Rose finally gets it through his little pea brain that spot betting games is far worse for his image and reinstatement, so he opens his mouth and tells another lie. I bet each and every game which John Dowd denied. The Dowd report was checked 3 ways and Rose thought he could fool the public with another lie.


Dowd told the program that Rose did not bet at all in the 1987 season when Mario Soto or Bill Gullickson pitched. He also said that Rose bet while he was playing.


Dowd said Rose will never get into the Hall of Fame and should just "get used to it."


http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2798498

People that think that Rose did no wrong on betting on his team to win are wrong themselves. Rose placed bets right under the NO GAMBLING sign, from his managers office. He spot bet games so when he wasn't betting it sent up a red flag to the bookies to bet on the other team. Also Rose was so far in debt to the bookies that it is more possible then not that the bookies convinced him on throwing games. I hear they have a way of doing that.

Old Sweater
08-30-2007, 03:30 AM
The NFL like MLB has put themselves in a corner with the Vick matter. They should have had stricker suspenions in previous years.

Look at the bottom and there is a player named Christian Peter accused twice for rape in college that played for 3 NFL teams.


NFL should worry about felons, not Owens4. Paul Hornung and Alex Karras
Hornung, the Packers "Golden Boy" running back and 1961 MVP, and Karras, an All-Pro defensive tackle for the Lions, were forced to sit out the 1963 season, suspended by NFL commish Pete Rozelle for betting on NFL games and associating with gamblers. Hornung had bet up to $500 on games, said Rozelle, and Karras had placed at least a half dozen $50-$100 bets.


Hornung apologized. "I made a terrible mistake," he said. "I am truly sorry." Karras also said he was sorry, in his own way. Upon returning to action in 1964, he refused when an official asked him to call the pregame coin toss: "I'm sorry, sir," he said. "I'm not permitted to gamble

November 9, 2005

I probably shouldn't talk about this -- because I absolutely abhor the NFL, and by talking about this, it only highlights the league more -- but I can't stand by and listen to this garbage much longer. Terrell Owens, the scourge of the Earth ... for yapping his trap?

Are you kidding me?

Ray Lewis, lauded as the human highlight every week, obstructed justice -- and that's letting him off easy -- in a murder investigation. Leonard Little, a hero of a defensive lineman in St. Louis, killed a woman while driving drunk.

Jamal Lewis was cheered when he returned from a four-month stay in prison for drug trafficking. Now we're all so concerned about Jamal's "feelings" and why he isn't playing like he used to. Just a hunch: he was in prison for four months.

Michael Pittman, rammed his Hummer into his wife's car -- with his 2-year-old son inside -- and was cheered earlier this season when he stepped in for an injured Cadillac Williams and ran for 100-plus yards.


http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=33552&highlight=&sid=f3d9973b35b65125fc2b457bf20515cf

-------------------------------------------------------------

Over 21% of the NFL's players have been arrested or indicted of major felonies.

http://www.thecommentary.ca/archives/20030925K.html

--------------------------------------------------------------

Consider just some of the cases that escaped the former commissioner's wrath. In the 1990s, Christian Peter, then an All-Big Eight defensive tackle, was arrested eight times at Nebraska, where he was twice accused of rape — charges resulting in one out-of-court settlement and another conviction for sexual assault. Though the Patriots relinquished their draft rights to Peter, he would eventually play for three NFL teams.

Then there was Peter's Nebraska teammate, Lawrence Phillips, who pleaded to a brutal domestic abuse case before St. Louis took him with the sixth pick in 1996. Phillips would be arrested three times over the next 19 months. Later, the Dolphins would release him after he was accused of hitting a woman in a bar. Of course, that incident proved an insufficient deterrent for the 49ers who also gave him a shot.

Next, Rams defensive end Leonard Little. In 1998, while driving drunk, he ran a red light and killed Susan Gutweiler, a 47-year-old wife and mother. As per Little's plea deal, he got 90 nights in a work release program and 1,000 hours of community service. In 2004, Little beat another drunk driving case. Last year, he signed a new contract with St. Louis.

Jamal Lewis, a convicted drug trafficker, was suspended for all of two games.

Finally, there's Ray Lewis, who pleaded to obstruction of justice in a double-murder case. Today, he's more of a hero than ever.


http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070821151432AA4AKBn



And here are the only 3 that I could find that actually recieved a lifetime suspension and wan't reinstated.


Life - Art Schlichter, Indianapolis, gambling, suspended for one year on June 1983. Was released following the 1985 season; pleaded guilty to an illegal gambling charge April 1, 1987. NFL Commissioner Pete Rozelle did not reinstate after Schlichter applied for permission to re-sign.

Life - Stanley Wilson, Cincinnati, substance abuse, suspended Jan. 22, 1989; permanently banned May 15, 1989.

Life - Earl Ferrell, Phoenix, 1990, substance abuse, voluntarily retired.

large
08-30-2007, 07:17 AM
While, apparently, you don't like Rose (almost obvious, heh, heh . . ) My point is this . . where's the equality? If Rose can be banned for life for his Gambling, (and it doesn't really matter how or who he gambled on) with no substance abuse, no state felonies or Interstate (federal) felonies, then why do we see other professional players, no matter the sport, convicted of such crimes, still playing?

And the lame argument that Vick should be reinstated and allowed to play Football again after he serves his time, because "He's paid his debt to society" is pure bullsh*t . . He's an Ex Con . . Let's see if he can get a job, based upon what he learned in college . . or will any potential employer look at him as I do, someone who attaches no value to life . . who looks at giving and taking life as no more than another "Sport" . . because it doesn't matter how many dogs Vick killed (or had killed), the act of watching two animals, or people for that matter, kill each other for "Sport" is sick and inhuman.

And then he says "He's found God" . . is he going to go into Rehab too?

Old Sweater
08-30-2007, 02:09 PM
While, apparently, you don't like Rose (almost obvious, heh, heh . . ) My point is this . . where's the equality? If Rose can be banned for life for his Gambling, (and it doesn't really matter how or who he gambled on) with no substance abuse, no state felonies or Interstate (federal) felonies, then why do we see other professional players, no matter the sport, convicted of such crimes, still playing?



There is equality as far as Rose go's. Every baseball player that has been caught gambling on his own team or being part of a fixed game has received a lifetime suspension, same as Rose. Rose was also convicted and served time for tax evasion. He has admitted to taking greenies or amphetamines. Rose is far from the All American picture that his backers like to think of him.


(and it doesn't really matter how or who he gambled on)

Huh! Maybe not to you. He broke what has always been baseballs #1 rule. There is a reason that a no gambling sign is required in the clubhouse. You are certainly welcome to find one baseball player that hasn't received a lifetime ban for gambling on his own team like Rose did if you really think he got screwed on the matter.

Your other questions is covered in the links I posted previously. You can't make up new conduct suspension laws for Vick that wasn't previously enforced and have any equality.




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_League_Baseball_scandals




Posted: Tuesday, 03 October 2006 5:17AM

Pete Rose Admits Taking 'Greenies' for Diet Reasons


NEW YORK (AP) -- Pete Rose says he took ``greenies'' in his playing days, if only to lose a few pounds. Oh, and he doesn't bet on baseball anymore, but if he did, he'd pick the Twins and the Padres.

In an appearance on the ``Late Show'' taped Monday, Rose was asked by host David Letterman whether he ever used any performance-enhancing drugs as a player. Rose said he never did, but when prodded about ``greenies,'' explained that he used them _ though they were nothing more than ``diet pills.''

``Well, I don't think greenies would ever help you do anything,'' he said. ``You know, I took greenies before in spring training only because I tried to lose some weight, see.''

Letterman then asked whether the pills ever helped him ward off fatigue.

``No, not like steroids,'' Rose replied. ``If I took steroids, I'd have gotten 5,000 damn hits.''

Old Sweater
08-31-2007, 05:08 AM
I think these are great!

large
08-31-2007, 07:54 AM
And you know all of this to be absolutely to be true because . .

You are (or have been) a Professional Sports Commissioner . .

You don't like Pete Rose . . (because the Red's beat the Yankees. That alone tells me you must not like anybody except the Rockies, because, while I don't know for sure, I'd bet that they are the only team that hasn't)

You were Billy Graham and Byron White's Teacher . .

All of the above . .

And then you say:
"You can't make up new conduct suspension laws for Vick that wasn't previously enforced and have any equality."

Wanna bet? The Feds may be through with Vick, and perhaps even Pro Football has made all their decisions, but the states are just getting started and I'm gonna bet that by the time Vick gets through serving the state time, he'll have to play Football with a walker . . How's that for "Equality"?

Old Sweater
08-31-2007, 08:55 PM
And you know all of this to be absolutely to be true because . .

You are (or have been) a Professional Sports Commissioner . .

You don't like Pete Rose . . (because the Red's beat the Yankees. That alone tells me you must not like anybody except the Rockies, because, while I don't know for sure, I'd bet that they are the only team that hasn't)

You were Billy Graham and Byron White's Teacher . .

All of the above . .

And then you say:

Wanna bet? The Feds may be through with Vick, and perhaps even Pro Football has made all their decisions, but the states are just getting started and I'm gonna bet that by the time Vick gets through serving the state time, he'll have to play Football with a walker . . How's that for "Equality"?

Or vice versa on your part. How much have you ever read on Pete Rose? Not much I assume since you used the word "Points instead of Runs" one thing any baseball fan never says. They have him by the short hairs like it or not. Convicted felon, admitted gambler, admitted drug user and a proven liar. What is there to like about the guy? Like I said in my first post, I long disliked Rose long before any of the accusations came along. Rose also ended catcher Ray Fosse's career, taking him out at home in a meaningless all star game.


You were Billy Graham and Byron White's Teacher . .

That is hardly true. My signature on 4 baseball boards is.


"I've cheated, or someone on my team has cheated, in almost every single game I've been in."> Rogers Hornsby

This from a man who averaged .400 for four seasons 1921-1924


I'm gonna bet that by the time Vick gets through serving the state time, he'll have to play Football with a walker . . How's that for "Equality"?

Not unless they make a apple out of Vick's felony compared to oranges for the other NFL felonies. Guess the courts could make up some new laws also for Vick compared to all the other NFL felons.

One year in prison and back in the NFL by 2010 for all the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ staring the NFL in the face.

Old Sweater
08-31-2007, 09:01 PM
Here you go Large. The John Dowd Report on Pete Rose.

Read it with a open mind and see if you are still on the Pete Rose bandwagon after you are through.

http://www.baseball1.com/bb-data/rose/dowd/dowd_cover.html

Old Sweater
08-31-2007, 09:57 PM
Goodell said he would review the suspension after all the legal proceedings against Vick are complete.

Vick is scheduled to plead guilty to federal dogfighting charges on Monday, but prosecutors took the unusual step of filing his plea agreement three days in advance because the case has attracted so much publicity. The agreement says Vick will plead guilty to a single conspiracy count and that prosecutors would recommend a sentence on the low end of federal guidelines, which both sides agree are 12 to 18 months in prison.

A source familiar with the plea negotiations had said Vick's attorneys hoped that the indirect wording of Vick's admissions on gambling and the killing of dogs would provide him with some measure of protection against possible state charges and an NFL suspension.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/08/24/AR2007082401044.html

Definitely won't need a walker and has a very good chance at early reinstatement. NFL has been doing it for years. If he had been caught like Pete Rose gambling on his own team he would be suspended for life.

large
09-01-2007, 07:57 AM
Personally I don't really give a fat rat's a$$ about Pete Rose, other than . . What he did is no where near a felony that would (or did) require imprisonment . . Because . . he didn't spend any time in jail . . did he? Nor was he prosecuted for committing either a federal or state felony. Was he?

The rest of these self important "Divas" beat up people in bars, shoot at people in the streets, use dope and steroids, setting great examples . . and then the "Divas" are literally "forgiven" because they can "Kick, Pass and Punt' . . Or throw a round ball into a basket . .

And then society wonders why kids shoot each other . . ?

Probably because they don't see much deterrent being applied in these high profile cases . . And as far as Tim Donaghy, he's just the tip of the iceberg, and if the investigation stops with him . . Pro basketball, which I watch little of anyway, will become just another Bullsh*t "Sport" like Pro Wrestling.

You see, statistics that some musclebound, third grade educated, two weeks and 20 million dollars away from the Ghetto Gangbanger accumulates while on his way to prison, doesn't get him a free pass when he gets out . . Because, he's still no better than some third rate gangbanger incarcerated for dealing or robbing and his rehab was no more than sharing a cell with the same . . will he learn anything? Probably not. Because if he was capable of understanding right from wrong, he'd have picked up on that BEFORE he got caught doing the dumb sh*t he went to jail for . .

And to get up in front of the public and cop a plea that he's "Found Jesus" . . screw him, he should have "Found Jesus" before he started committing State and federal Crimes . . .

And I'm not just down on Vick or Donaghy, but all those who think that a multimillion dollar contract releases you from the obligation to know right from wrong . . even the Denver Bronco who was killed last year . . he was partly to blame for his own death . . You go where the Gangbangers hang, you may become a victim . . and he went there, in a White Stretch Hummer . . It's called "Co-Negligence" in Colorado law . . not to mention, "Birds of a feather, flock together" . .

One other thing of note . . you quote Mickey Mantle with your signature line . . denigrating Rose's record . . he has one . . do you OR Mantle?

Zen Curmudgeon
09-01-2007, 06:06 PM
Personally I don't really give a fat rat's a$$ about Pete Rose, other than . . What he did is no where near a felony that would (or did) require imprisonment . . Because . . he didn't spend any time in jail . . did he? Nor was he prosecuted for committing either a federal or state felony. Was he?It wasn't for gambling, but he did federal time (http://reds.enquirer.com/2004/01/06/red1timeline.html).


April 20, 1990: Rose pleads guilty to two felony counts of filing false income tax returns.

July 19, 1990: Rose is sentenced to five months in prison and fined $50,000.

Aug. 8, 1990: Rose begins serving his five-month prison sentence at Marion (Ill.) Federal prison camp.

Jan. 7, 1991: Rose is released from federal prison in Marion, Ill. He begins the second part of his sentence, consisting of 1,000 hours of community service at Cincinnati inner-city schools. ZC

Old Sweater
09-02-2007, 02:49 AM
Personally I don't really give a fat rat's a$$ about Pete Rose, other than . . What he did is no where near a felony that would (or did) require imprisonment . . Because . . he didn't spend any time in jail . . did he? Nor was he prosecuted for committing either a federal or state felony. Was he?


Not while he was in baseball was he convicted of a felony but as the post under yours says he was convicted for tax evasion. Pete can thank his lucky stars that the federal government didn't go after him. There is enough evidence from the Dowd report regarding activity with illegal gamblers to convict him. Just like you said, sports stars get away with more then the average citizen.


And then society wonders why kids shoot each other . . ?

And Pete has his hands full with Pete Jr.



BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Betty, this is actually an important precursor to the date-rape drug. The drug that Pete Rose Jr. is accused of trafficking is called GBL. Now, once that enters the system it becomes another drug called GHB. Both have very long clinical names. GHB is actually the date-rape drug, but GBL, which Pete Rose Jr., is accused of trafficking, is the precursor to it. Once it enters the body, as we said, it becomes the date rape drug.

Now, we are told that Pete Rose Jr. has just turned himself in at U.S. district court in Nashville, Tennessee, and he is expected to plead guilty, charged with one count of conspiracy to possess and distribute the so-called date rape drug or its precursor. Federal authorities tell CNN Pete Rose Jr. confessed that he had received shipments of the drug from another man while Rose was playing with the minor league Chattanooga Lookouts. The son of the legendary baseball star, according to agents, admitted to supplying several members of that team with the drug.

Team officials say they have no knowledge of that, but Drug Enforcement Administration officials tell CNN Rose said teammates would take the drug to, quote, "wind down after games." Agents tell us that Rose, who is in court at this hour, is a small player in a much larger operation.

This in fact is part of a six-year investigation that last year netted one of the biggest hauls ever of the date-rape drug. As we say, that precursor known as GBL. About 280 gallons was seized in January of last year in Murphyesboro, Tennessee. We have tried to reach Pete Rose Jr.'s attorney and Pete Rose Sr. for comment. They have not returned our phone calls -- Betty.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0511/07/lol.01.html

Then there is the gamblers and drug pushers that Rose ran with I'm sure you wouldn't want your kids around.



As with many of Rose's other former acquaintances, Peters's life has come crashing down on him. In July 1988, Janszen, working for federal investigators as part of a plea-bargaining arrangement, set up the cocaine deal in which Peters was busted. Also hit with a costly divorce settlement, Peters filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy and is in the process of selling Jonathan's.

Are Peters, Janszen and the other Rose accusers mentioned in Dowd's report telling the truth about their dealings with the Reds manager? Even if Rose is right that Janszen was blackmailing him, that doesn't mean that Janszen wasn't placing baseball bets for him. On the contrary, it's hard to blackmail somebody unless you have something to blackmail him about. And why didn't Rose go to the police with his blackmail story? Instead, during this period, on March 18, 1988, one of his lawyers, Katz, arranged for a $10,000 check to Janszen, thus giving the impression that he and Rose may have submitted to the "blackmail." Rose's legal team has characterized the $10,000 payment as a loan.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/si_online/news/2002/12/10/rose_flashback/



Probably because they don't see much deterrent being applied in these high profile cases . . And as far as Tim Donaghy, he's just the tip of the iceberg, and if the investigation stops with him . . Pro basketball, which I watch little of anyway, will become just another Bullsh*t "Sport" like Pro Wrestling.

I agree with you about Pro Wrestling being a BS sport. Pete Rose is in their Hall of Fame. Didn't you know that?


Mar 2, 2004
STAMFORD, Conn., March 2, 2004 – Baseball great Pete Rose will be the first-ever special celebrity inductee into the WWE® Hall of Fame for his classic appearances at WrestleMania XIV, WrestleMania XV, and WrestleMania 2000. WWE Superstars to be inducted as the newest members of the WWE Hall of Fame are former Minnesota Governor Jesse Ventura, Bobby “The Brain” Heenan, Greg “The Hammer” Valentine, Sgt. Slaughter, Superstar Billy Graham, Tito Santana, Don Muraco, Harley Race, Junkyard Dog and Big John Studd.


http://corporate.wwe.com/news/2004/2004_03_02.jsp


And to get up in front of the public and cop a plea that he's "Found Jesus" . . screw him, he should have "Found Jesus" before he started committing State and federal Crimes . . .

Just like Rose denying he bet on baseball for 14 years then gets all remorseful and comes clean to sell his book. Everything you condemn Vick for you sweep under the rug for Rose, don't you?


One other thing of note . . you quote Mickey Mantle with your signature line . . denigrating Rose's record . . he has one . . do you OR Mantle?

It's not degrading, it's the truth. Rose actually outweighed Mantle by 10lbs( guess those amphetamines didn't work that he took) but was satisfied hitting singles.

Mantle holds numerous WS lifetime records and most career HR's by a switch hitter. He also won 3 mvp's compared to Rose's one and you can throw in a triple crown that Rose the singles hitter never had a chance at. Mantle is also on a lot more top 20 and top 10 lists than Rose.

Here is their HOF ink.

Mickey Mantle

Black Ink: Batting - 65 (13) (Average HOFer ≈ 27)
Gray Ink: Batting - 272 (17) (Average HOFer ≈ 144)
HOF Standards: Batting - 64.7 (19) (Average HOFer ≈ 50)
HOF Monitor: Batting - 284.5 (14) (Likely HOFer > 100)

Pete Rose

Black Ink: Batting - 64 (15) (Average HOFer ≈ 27)
Gray Ink: Batting - 239 (24) (Average HOFer ≈ 144)
HOF Standards: Batting - 55.0 (49) (Average HOFer ≈ 50)
HOF Monitor: Batting - 313.0 (11) (Likely HOFer > 100)

These are by Bill James theories that I don't care for but are half way accurate since the standard is composed off existing HOF members.

Rose has great numbers, to bad he broke baseballs number one rule of betting on his own team. Same go's for Shoeless Joe, he was a lock also.

I never have said I condone one single thing that Vick has done. I have said all along that Rose is as bad as Vick. You seem to admire Rose for being a convicted felon, lying to the public 3 times, illegal gambling, taking amphetamines, coming clean to sell a book, and associating with drug pushers.

Why is this?

Old Sweater
09-02-2007, 03:32 AM
It wasn't for gambling, but he did federal time (http://reds.enquirer.com/2004/01/06/red1timeline.html).

ZC

And Rose still owes the government at the time of this 2004 article by the Smoking Gun. There is also a picture of the tax lien.


Rose owes Uncle Sam a total of $973,693.28 for the years 1997, 1999, 2000, 2001, and 2002 (the lien notes that the IRS has "made a demand for payment of this liability, but it remains unpaid").

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0818043rose1.html

And a quick summary from Baseball Almanac


Did you know that during the actual investigation, more than eighty exhibits were presented as physical evidence against Pete Rose?

The Pete Rose check was the "smoking gun" which linked him to the bookie Ron Peters. How? Peters claimed to have a conversation with Rose wherein he personally refused to take any more game bets from Rose due to a $34,000.00 debt. Rose "exploded" during the discussion and told Peters he gave Tommy Gioiosa a check for the amount due. Rose then produced a copy of the check for Peters and discussed the possibility that Gioiosa "stiffed both of them."

Rule 21 of the Major League Rules state: Any player, umpire, or club or league official or employee, who shall bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in connection with which the bettor has a duty to perform shall be declared permanently ineligible.


http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/p_rosec.shtml

large
09-02-2007, 10:24 AM
Again, I don't care . . Just make sure Vick gets the same attention . . which apparently he hasn't yet to receive.

Where's the IRS on this deal? Hasn't made a peep . .

Why is there ANY discussion about whether he'll play football after his sentence is completed?

My whole objection to all of it is the "Equality" of the punishment. You guys can pi$$ and moan all day about Rose, his Kid, his Dog and anything the poor stupid bastard has done, and continue to advocate that you don't like him . . And regardless, "worn out sweater" . . He established a record by hitting a little round ball, thrown by Major League pitchers, 4652 times and managing to run to first base, safely. I don't really care if he was using a walker to get to first base when he completed it, and I don't care whether he was screwing Marge Schott to enable him to stay on the team to do so . . The number is there, and you aren't . .

That being said, People in sports who use alcohol, dope, steroids, are involved in violence, whether it's wife beating or murder should, indeed, be treated differently than the common criminal. They should have none of the "three strikes, you're out" treatment the average felon gets, but should be told, up front, You're a College Graduate (in 99% of the cases) and you damned well should have known better . . See ya . . You're a convict now . . Why? Simply because as a "High Profile" person who gets millions to influence the youthful buying public, they chose to "Influence" them negatively.

The argument that, somehow, they're "Human", so are forgiveable for committing errors in judgement, is pure Bull$hit. when any man (or woman) is given $100 million dollars, plus $20 or so mil just for "Signing", they are also "Inheriting" unwritten obligations to act like the professional they have been paid to become . . and if they don't, banish them forever, they have no place in the business . . No matter how talented they are or how good their lawyers . .

Zen Curmudgeon
09-02-2007, 10:52 AM
Again, I don't care . . Just make sure Vick gets the same attention . . which apparently he hasn't yet to receive. Best joke so far, from Bill Maher. He noted that Leona Helmsley had cut her grnadchildren out of her will but left $12 million to her dog. "No word yet on what the dog plans to spend the money on, but Michael Vick is f***ked."

ZC

Old Sweater
09-06-2007, 11:46 PM
My whole objection to all of it is the "Equality" of the punishment. You guys can pi$$ and moan all day about Rose, his Kid, his Dog and anything the poor stupid bastard has done, and continue to advocate that you don't like him . . And regardless, "worn out sweater" . . He established a record by hitting a little round ball, thrown by Major League pitchers, 4652 times and managing to run to first base, safely. I don't really care if he was using a walker to get to first base when he completed it, and I don't care whether he was screwing Marge Schott to enable him to stay on the team to do so . . The number is there, and you aren't . .

That being said, People in sports who use alcohol, dope, steroids, are involved in violence, whether it's wife beating or murder should, indeed, be treated differently than the common criminal. They should have none of the "three strikes, you're out" treatment the average felon gets, but should be told, up front, You're a College Graduate (in 99% of the cases) and you damned well should have known better . . See ya . . You're a convict now . . Why? Simply because as a "High Profile" person who gets millions to influence the youthful buying public, they chose to "Influence" them negatively.

That is what gets me about you Large, you don't care how Rose got the record in the first paragraph and you don't seem to care that Rose done some of the things you mention in the 2nd paragraph.(drugs & alcohol)

Everything you say to defend Rose about his gambling you want to stick to Vick. Somewhat confusing.

At no point have I said what Vick done was right but time after time you defend Rose and that record when he was gambling and playing the game on greenies. Of course that doesnt even seem to bother you.

Large= OK for Rose to do drugs, gamble illegally on own team.*while falling on knees to worship him*

Large= Lock up Vick and enforce lifetime ban for illegal gambling and animal cruelty on dogs.*while never once bringing up other NFL players who have done worst crimes to humans and still played in the NFL*

Old Sweater
09-06-2007, 11:51 PM
>>>"worn out sweater"<<<<

If that was suppose to be a personal attack you have the wrong kind of sweater in mind. If you knew anything about baseballs history you should know it means fan. You know"sweating the action"???? Guess not.

large
09-07-2007, 07:39 AM
Obviously, you are dense as used Uranium . . I don't care how Pete Rose got his record, it's on the books. and he had to stand up to a major league pitcher to get the hits he got . . Doesn't matter if he took 60 years to do it either, because when Babe Ruth set the home run record, he only got to play about half the games a year the contemporary players do now . . so he was handicapped from the start . . Time doesn't seem to mean much when discussing sports records and achievements.

Point still is . . You're a professional Athlete, paid to large sums to play a Sport (of some kind), and a definite minority . . If you can't set the example, get out, leave the business . . and if that's good enough for Rose, then it's good enough for Vick, Donaghy, and anybody else who gets caught cheating . .

And not to be redundant, but in case, obviously, you can't read, allow me . . from above . .

That being said, People in sports who use alcohol, dope, steroids, are involved in violence, whether it's wife beating or murder should, indeed, be treated differently than the common criminal. They should have none of the "three strikes, you're out" treatment the average felon gets, but should be told, up front, You're a College Graduate (in 99% of the cases) and you damned well should have known better . . See ya . . You're a convict now . . Why? Simply because as a "High Profile" person who gets millions to influence the youthful buying public, they chose to "Influence" them negatively.

The argument that, somehow, they're "Human", so are forgiveable for committing errors in judgement, is pure Bull$hit. when any man (or woman) is given $100 million dollars, plus $20 or so mil just for "Signing", they are also "Inheriting" unwritten obligations to act like the professional they have been paid to become . . and if they don't, banish them forever, they have no place in the business . . No matter how talented they are or how good their lawyers . .

Understand now, dipstick?